The song Ironic by Alanis Morissette

[Jimboismyman]

So Im in the midst of a good debate about this song. I say there is NO Irony in the whole song. While my friend sees some Irony.. what says BB.com?


Lyrics
"Ironic"

An old man turned ninety-eight
He won the lottery and died the next day
It's a black fly in your Chardonnay
It's a death row pardon two minutes too late
And isn't it ironic... don't you think

It's like rain on your wedding day
It's a free ride when you've already paid
It's the good advice that you just didn't take
Who would've thought... it figures

Mr. Play It Safe was afraid to fly
He packed his suitcase and kissed his kids goodbye
He waited his whole **** life to take that flight
And as the plane crashed down he thought
"Well isn't this nice..."
And isn't it ironic... don't you think

It's like rain on your wedding day
It's a free ride when you've already paid
It's the good advice that you just didn't take
Who would've thought... it figures

Well life has a funny way of sneaking up on you
When you think everything's okay and everything's going right
And life has a funny way of helping you out when
You think everything's gone wrong and everything blows up
In your face

A traffic jam when you're already late
A no-smoking sign on your cigarette break
It's like ten thousand spoons when all you need is a knife
It's meeting the man of my dreams
And then meeting his beautiful wife
And isn't it ironic...don't you think
A little too ironic...and, yeah, I really do think...

It's like rain on your wedding day
It's a free ride when you've already paid
It's the good advice that you just didn't take
Who would've thought... it figures

Life has a funny way of sneaking up on you
Life has a funny, funny way of helping you out
Helping you out

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

ironic? ... more like **** for luck if you ask me

[Jimboismyman]

I said that it was all bad luck.. Nothing was ironic in that song by far

[life_of_faith]

well my definition of ironic is what is expected and what actually is. I think i agree with your friend on this one especially winning the lottery and dying the next day. That is huge irony

[JayHawk]

You are missing the big picture. What is more ironic than singing a song about irony that has no actual irony in it?

[Jimboismyman]

See that's what she said.
I studied this in English this year and we defined that line as
"While and amusing (morbid) coincidence, there is nothing ironic about his death".

[life_of_faith]

See that's what she said.
I studied this in English this year and we defined that line as
"While and amusing (morbid) coincidence, there is nothing ironic about his death".

his death is ot ironic. Him winning the lottery the day before foreshadows a new full rich life that he could begin living, but he suddenly dies the next day. Nobody see's the irony in this?

by the way this is a good song, she has a good voice

[Jimboismyman]

his death is ot ironic. Him winning the lottery the day before foreshadows a new full rich life that he could begin living, but he suddenly dies the next day. Nobody see's the irony in this?

by the way this is a good song, she has a good voice

It would have been ironic if he died while he was scratching the ticket off and the guy who sold it took the ticket.... That would be Situational Irony


but yes.. good song

[life_of_faith]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8v9yUVgrmPY

her video of this song is weird though

[erak]

You are missing the big picture. What is more ironic than singing a song about irony that has no actual irony in it?


Excellent point!:thumbsup:

[erak]

Isn't it ironic to be analyzing lyrics to a song from 1995 though?

I like that song- her album is a classic.

[Jimboismyman]

Isn't it ironic to be analyzing lyrics to a song from 1995 though?

I like that song- her album is a classic.

:lol2:
We studied it in English while we were reading 1984 so we could figure out if there was irony in the book

[erak]

How about "cosmic irony" in her song?

[Jimboismyman]

If you find any..let me know!

[erak]

"Cosmic irony is disparity between human desires and the harsh realities of the outside world (or the whims of the gods)."

98 yr-old guy winning lottery and dying next day; meeting man of her dreams and his wife....Cosmic irony.

[Jimboismyman]

Alanis came OUT and said it wasnt Ironic.. so I win :-p

but ur def is different then mine

[erak]

Alanis came OUT and said it wasnt Ironic.. so I win :-p

but ur def is different then mine

Artists lose control of the meaning of their work after they finish it- it's what the beholder perceives rather than what the artist meant to convey..... So Alanis's POV doesn't matter!

I think the cosmic irony definition fits- cosmic irony isn't considered irony in the classic definition, though.

[Jimboismyman]

Artists lose control of the meaning of their work after they finish it- it's what the beholder perceives rather than what the artist meant to convey..... So Alanis's POV doesn't matter!

I think the cosmic irony definition fits- cosmic irony isn't considered irony in the classic definition, though.

My defintion was

Cosmic Irony- This type of irony is when human beings loose control of their egos. We must remember the universe is bigger then us, nature is unpredictable and uncontrollable, and we are powerful, yer small on the planet.
Example: The great "unsinkable" Titanic

[speedracer216]

the song should've been title "sucks to be you"

[life_of_faith]

you you youuuu oughta knoww...her other good song

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

there is irony in the guy finally getting on a plane and then dying. most of the other stuff isnt irony.

[BeastOfTheEast]

Isn't she also the singer that had that song with the lyrics, "best friend with benefits" in it?

What WAS that song?

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

Isn't she also the singer that had that song with the lyrics, "best friend with benefits" in it?

What WAS that song?

Head over feet.....same album

[ThirdMan75]

there is irony in the guy finally getting on a plane and then dying. most of the other stuff isnt irony.

I would agree with the "Mr.Play it safe" argument. A fear of flying his whole life, and when he finally does, he crashes. That's a little ironic... don't you think?

[Bigfatbillsfan]

See that's what she said.
I studied this in English this year and we defined that line as
"While and amusing (morbid) coincidence, there is nothing ironic about his death".

That is correct Jimbo. I believe that she actualy came out and said there was no irony in this song.

a good example of how this song could be ironic would be something like the guy that wouldn't get on a plane because he didn't want to die in a plane crashed was killed when a plane crashed on his house.

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironic_%28song%29

this is what wikipedia has to say:
Linguistic usage disputes


Look up ironic in
Wiktionary, the free dictionary.
The song's usage of the word "ironic" attracted attention for what many feel is an improper application of the term. Some situations that Morissette describes in the song are arguably examples of cosmic irony: events that, as the Oxford English Dictionary puts it, appear "as if in mockery of the fitness or rightness of things", such as "a death row pardon/two minutes too late". Others appear to be merely unfortunate (not even improbable or coincidental), such as "a black fly/in your Chardonnay" or "A traffic jam/when you're already late." If one discounts cosmic irony, however, it is arguable that the song is ironic in and of itself - there is a fundamental incongruity in a song titled "Ironic" which ultimately contains no irony, an interpretation that Morissette herself has supported.
An analysis of the ironic lack of irony in "Ironic" by Irish comedian Ed Byrne includes:
"There's nothing ironic about being stuck in a traffic jam when you're late for something. Unless you're a town planner. If you were a town planner and you were late for a seminar of town planners at which you were giving a talk on how you solved the problem of traffic congestion in your area, couldn't get to it because you got stuck in a traffic jam, that'd be well ironic."
"Rain on your wedding day is ironic only if marrying a weatherman and he set the date."
"A no-smoking sign on your cigarette break, that's inconsiderate office management. A no-smoking sign in a cigarette factory - irony."
"Ten thousand spoons? How big is your sink, Alanis? What do you need this knife for - to stab the bloke who keeps leaving spoons all over your house?"
The song and video were discussed at length in VH1's I Love the '90s. Mo Rocca commented in the broadcast, "Irony is the disparity between what you expect will happen and what does happen. So raining on your wedding day isn't ironic; it's just crappy. It would have been ironic if she had lived in a place like Seattle and traveled to the desert of Mexico for a wedding, and it ended up raining there, but not in Seattle. Alanis always gets the last laugh though. We all sit here, saying her song isn't ironic, but in fact, that's pretty ironic that she wrote a song called 'Ironic' that wasn't really ironic. Those Canadians are pretty crafty."
"Ironic" was parodied in an MTV television commercial featuring Donal Logue as a cab-driver with his quadruplicate counterparts spouting similarly un-ironic ideas. (One sample: "It's like meeting the girl of your dreams and finding out she's five.")
[edit]Alanis' thoughts on Ironic

Morissette herself does in fact acknowledge that "Ironic" is not filled with ironies and this in itself is what makes it (in her opinion) ironic. Additionally, she confirms that she is a self-dubbed "malapropism queen" and alleges that the song was lighthearted and not taken too seriously at the time it was written. It should be noted that the naming of the song 'Ironic' is not a malapropism, which is again, (perhaps) quite ironic.
“ For me the great debate on whether what I was saying in ‘Ironic’ was ironic wasn’t a traumatic debate. I’d always embraced the fact that every once in a while I’d be the malapropism queen. And when Glen and I were writing it, we definitely were not doggedly making sure that everything was technically ironic. It’s a testament to the fact that we didn’t think it was going to be put under the microscope by 30 million people. For me the sweetest moment came in New York when a woman came up to me in a record store and said, ‘So all those things in the “Ironic” aren’t ironic.’ And then she said, ‘And that’s the irony.’ I said, ‘Yup.’ To me it’s a real snapshot of a nineteen-year-old’s definition and version of how life worked at the time. All that ‘Ironic’ touches on spawned all my future inquiries into and current understandings of the mysteries of life. ”
[1]

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

That is correct Jimbo. I believe that she actualy came out and said there was no irony in this song.

a good example of how this song could be ironic would be something like the guy that wouldn't get on a plane because he didn't want to die in a plane crashed was killed when a plane crashed on his house.

Thats text book irony and arfin brutal

[BillsFan4490]

spoons line is irony i think

[fjl2nd]

Man, that whole album is CLASSIC.

"Not the Doctor" and "Head over Feet" are definitely great songs.

[Jimboismyman]

That is correct Jimbo. I believe that she actualy came out and said there was no irony in this song.

a good example of how this song could be ironic would be something like the guy that wouldn't get on a plane because he didn't want to die in a plane crashed was killed when a plane crashed on his house.

That is what I said.. or he surives the plane ride and dies tripping down the stairs.. Something he doesn't normally fear

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

I would agree with the "Mr.Play it safe" argument. A fear of flying his whole life, and when he finally does, he crashes. That's a little ironic... don't you think?

What would be ironic is if "Mr. Play it Safe", who never flew and was scared of everything, got killed by something totally mundane and ordinary like ... getting his mail out of the mailbox or falling in his shower. That is irony. Right?

[Jimboismyman]

What would be ironic is if "Mr. Play it Safe", who never flew and was scared of everything, got killed by something totally mundane and ordinary like ... getting his mail out of the mailbox or falling in his shower. That is irony. Right?

Yes!! Something he wouldn't expect to die from.. Maybe he gets off the plane and walks out of the airport and gets hit by a car... Cuz he's not afraid of crossing the street

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

Yes!! Something he wouldn't expect to die from.. Maybe he gets off the plane and walks out of the airport and gets hit by a car... Cuz he's not afraid of crossing the street

Aren't you late for school!?! LOL

[Jimboismyman]

Aren't you late for school!?! LOL

Im at school. First period is Web Design and we have nothing to do. So im with my bff and surfing the web.. this site is fianlly unblocked

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

Im at school. First period is Web Design and we have nothing to do. So im with my bff and surfing the web.. this site is fianlly unblocked

WOW!! That's crazy! LOL I couldn't figure out how you were online. :)

You know what's ironic? .... hmmm I can't think of anything either LMAO

[Jimboismyman]

WOW!! That's crazy! LOL I couldn't figure out how you were online. :)

You know what's ironic? .... hmmm I can't think of anything either LMAO

ACtually this site was blocked 10-12th grade b/c I was caught on this site during Keyboarding in 10th grade. Twas blocked but now it isnt

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

ACtually this site was blocked 10-12th grade b/c I was caught on this site during Keyboarding in 10th grade. Twas blocked but now it isnt

LOL You little rogue!! You were typing on BBMB in 10th grade while in school! EVIL you are!! ;)

[Jimboismyman]

LOL You little rogue!! You were typing on BBMB in 10th grade while in school! EVIL you are!! ;)

lol! it was very dead in the morning back then at this hour.. not many people posting.
5 mins to the end of Period 1

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

lol! it was very dead in the morning back then at this hour.. not many people posting.
5 mins to the end of Period 1

awww Last period 1 ... EVER!! :) YOU GO GIRL!!

What's next?

How many exams do you have?

[Jimboismyman]

awww Last period 1 ... EVER!! :) YOU GO GIRL!!

What's next?

How many exams do you have?

period 2: Study Hall
Period 3: French ---> Movie
4: Math ---> Party
5th: English ----> Exam
6th : Lunch ----->
7th ----> I AM OUT!

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

period 2: Study Hall
Period 3: French ---> Movie
4: Math ---> Party
5th: English ----> Exam
6th : Lunch ----->
7th ----> I AM OUT!

S'amuser !

[billzmark]

......That song brings me back to 1995 or 1996.... Good times.....Good times...
This song is about irony?? Just kidding..

[JayHawk]

by the way this is a good song, she has a good voice


I'm astounded that anyone would say that shrill harpy has a good voice. that shrieking is worse than nails on a chalkboard.

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

I'm astounded that anyone would say that shrill harpy has a good voice. that shrieking is worse than nails on a chalkboard.

Hawk, where've you been lately? You seem a little on the down low...

PS - I am not much of a fan of her voice either.

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

There's different types of irony which is where the confusion comes from a lot of the time.

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

There's different types of irony which is where the confusion comes from a lot of the time.

Yeah but Lar, don't ya think it would be ironic if "play it safe boy" spent the greater part of his life avoiding risks and then was killed of something virtually risk-free? I think his taking a risk and then getting killed is not ironic, but tragic... well duh, of course it's tragic, but "ironic"? ... Not so much.

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

I'm astounded that anyone would say that shrill harpy has a good voice. that shrieking is worse than nails on a chalkboard.


I think she does too....but not in a traditional way. Yes she absolutely can get shrill and grating...but I do think she has a subtle tone to her voice on some of her quieter more subdued songs. I dont like how she pronounces things...she accents syllables that make her shrillness shine through. Specifically the "aye" sound....she always drills that... "SI-lence"

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

Yeah but Lar, don't ya think it would be ironic if "play it safe boy" spent the greater part of his life avoiding risks and then was killed of something virtually risk-free? I think his taking a risk and then getting killed is not ironic, but tragic... well duh, of course it's tragic, but "ironic"? ... Not so much.


Sure I think thats pretty ironic but in its own way. Like the prior poster said, if he were to stay home specifically because he thought he'd die in aplane crash and then actually die in a plane crash when a plane landed on his house it would be like the most classic version of irony. But the whole expected/unexpected thing leaves the door open for other possibilities. For instance....the set up when someone is afraid of flying is that the fear is irrational. Its the whole "why are you afraid, you'll be fine" but then his fear was actually justified because he DID crash.

heres more wiki-love on the subject of irony....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony



Wikipedia is the most fascinating crap in the world...

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

I love situational irony. That sense of contradiction really strikes a chord with me. I remember I was on the Falcons boards one day and some kid misspelled a word. This other kid totally got on his case and posted something to the effect of "Why should I believe your opinion when you cant even speel "possibly""

Obviously I was all over that one....something about correcting someone's spelling while misspelling "spell" is just hysterical!

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

I love situational irony. That sense of contradiction really strikes a chord with me. I remember I was on the Falcons boards one day and some kid misspelled a word. This other kid totally got on his case and posted something to the effect of "Why should I believe your opinion when you cant even speel "possibly""

Obviously I was all over that one....something about correcting someone's spelling while misspelling "spell" is just hysterical!

Oh GAWD! That's CLASSIC :)

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

Sure I think thats pretty ironic but in its own way. Like the prior poster said, if he were to stay home specifically because he thought he'd die in aplane crash and then actually die in a plane crash when a plane landed on his house it would be like the most classic version of irony. But the whole expected/unexpected thing leaves the door open for other possibilities. For instance....the set up when someone is afraid of flying is that the fear is irrational. Its the whole "why are you afraid, you'll be fine" but then his fear was actually justified because he DID crash.

heres more wiki-love on the subject of irony....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony



Wikipedia is the most fascinating crap in the world...


FYI ... I am 'fraid of flying. I hate it :(
Let's not talk about this anymore. I have two trips coming up soon and I am already anxious :(

[DoYouSeeWhatHappensLarry]

FYI ... I am 'fraid of flying. I hate it :(
Let's not talk about this anymore. I have two trips coming up soon and I am already anxious :(

Hahaha...ok moving on...

[TBBills Fan]

Isn't she also the singer that had that song with the lyrics, "best friend with benefits" in it?

What WAS that song?


already won me over in spite of me.....

[DancesWithBuffaloes]

already won me over in spite of me.....

Wow!

That is one I haven't heard in a while.

[BeastOfTheEast]

Janis Joplin Jr.

[TBBills Fan]

Wow!

That is one I haven't heard in a while.

that song has special meaning with my wife and I

think:

teenagers, mushrooms and a tree of on the side of the road in Canada....lol

[life_of_faith]

their should have been a poll with this so we can know the percentages of who thinks the song has irony and the people (that are wrong) don't see any irony

[Savior77]

Black flies in chardonnay is not ironic...that's a color gradient.

[buffaloheaven]

I think the song is annoying so I don't care what it means.

[erak]

Good for you- don't post in the thread then.

I for one think she is a talent, and that album was outstanding. I'm a fan of her.